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Old 03-13-2008, 09:01 PM
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Why do you say Paul didn't teach what Yeshua taught?

It is often said that Paul should be ignored and discredited because most of his teachings don't match with Yeshuas. They call him sexist and say that he instituted many things into worship that Yeshua never did.
However Yeshua was a Jew who mainly taught to Jews. The Disciples was also Jewish. Christainity started as a Jewish sect. Yeshua had no reason or cause to tell his audience how to worship or how to act according to the faith. They already knew how to do this.
Paul mainly taught and wrote to new Gentile Christians. They had no clue or Idea how to worship God. Many was pagans so Paul had to teach them the Jewish way of worship. For this reason alone people get the wrong Idea of Paul and think he didn't teach what Yeshua taught.

Why do you think people get this idea?
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:01 PM
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First of all, when Paul started his ministry, Jesus had been dead for about 30 years. Jesus had come to confirm the Law
to the letter according to Matthew 5:17-19. When Paul came he said that the Law had been abolished. It's in Ephesians 2:15.

Since Jesus' death and all the way through about 30 years, the converts of the Apostles of Jesus through the Sect of the Nazarenes would become staunch defenders of the Law, according to Acts 21:20. And Paul would teach the Jews among the Gentiles to abandon Moses, to give up circumcision, and their customs, according to Acts 21:21.

Therefore, the above is enough to answer your question about Paul teaching against what Jesus taught.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:03 PM
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People get this idea bcoz they cant follow his teachings and think that Jesus teachings are more easy to follow. but they really dont the depth of His commandments. He said love ur God with all ur Heart, mind and strength. btu these people think its easy to do that.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:03 PM
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I like Paul.

I don't believe that anyone who has read Romans and says that it is not the inspired work of God knows what being saved by grace means.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:25 PM
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For a moment, pl. accept that the Message of my lord Jesus Christ was 'in continuation' to Divinity's Messages to humans through His chosen persons..exalted as His Prophets. At times the recipients were Jews.They were as good Believers as the earlier nations, and, the following nations, in their own times. No one had the authority to introduce 'innovations'.The point to seek is whether Paul's preachings were or were not innovations on the centrality of all The Messages from The Supreme Lord (God the Father, Pramatma, Jehova, ..Allah..) .Also believe,for a moment, that all the nations, in all the geographical regions, speaking all the different languages have been the recipients of The Core Message. None has been denied this Grace. Then, may the Asker please compare the preachings of St.Paul with the Gospel of Jesus Christ,with the Torah, and, then, also with the Quran..to make own opinion whether Paul was an innovator or a preacher-of-Jesus-message. Blessings on this question.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:26 PM
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I have been drinking and playing cards with Paul for about 7 years now and I can honestly say that whoever this Yeshua character you are going on about is, they don't hold a candle to Paul. Granted, after a couple beers Paul can get a little jaded at times and does tend to rant a little more than normal, but he is so damn funny that I can not get over it. Let me know if you are up for coming over sometime so that you can meet Paul in person, instead of believing all the nonsense that you hear on the street.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:27 PM
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Scroll down on the link below to read the anti-Jewish polemic in the New Testament.

The New Testament is precisely why people have the idea.

Pauline dogma that asserts abrogation of the eternal covenant is contradictory to Torah.

The second link addresses problems with claims of Paul and about him in the New Testament.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:28 PM
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Yes, Christianity DID start as a sect within Judaism. And yes, Jesus taught Judaism - it was the only religion he knew. For example, 'Love thy neighbour' is in the Torah. It is a JEWISH teaching. Jesus did not 'start' a new faith.

But only a few Jews ever followed Jesus. He did not have a large ministry while alive. 99% of Jews KNEW what the Torah said and thus knew that Jesus was not the Jewish messiah - especially when he died before fulfilling any of the Jewish messianic prophecies! (there is no 'second coming' for the Jewish messiah).

PAUL did NOT teach Judaism. Absolutely not. When the Jews stuck to their own religion and refused to worship Jesus, Paul had to take his message to the Pagans and the Gentiles. There, the new faith, Christianity, was embraced. In order to attract more Pagans, the concept of the 'trinity' was introduced. Pagans already worshipped a plethora of deities so the 'trinity' worked like a charm.

Christianity as we know it today is pretty much the religion that PAUL developed. It is certainly NOT what Jesus taught, because Jesus lived and died a practising Jew. Jesus followed the Torah and in the Torah, G-d makes it clear that his covenant with the Jews is ETERNAL.

Yet Christianity teaches that Judaism is an 'irrelevant' faith that has been 'replaced'. Of course this is absurd - the very fact that Jews have survived and even flourished proves that G-d's covenant with the Jews is still alive and well!
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:29 PM
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Well, you sort of answer your own question. Paul didn't teach what Jesus taught. He taught different stuff. However, I do find myself wondering how much of Paul's message (on how to worship, to the Corinthians, for example) is actually relevant to us today.

Should I constrain people who are moved by the Holy Spirit to sing and worship God purely on the grounds that they are female? Is it really "disgraceful" in the Twenty-First Century for a woman to speak in church?

This is an obvious example, but there are others in the letters that I read and find myself thinking "well that's *your* opinion, Paul, but I respectfully disagree". Paul preached the message of Christ crucified for our sins and of the salvation from sin embodied in his resurrection and to that I happily give a loud "Amen!" But, frankly, if my wife wants to give it a loud "Amen!" too, then she can and if Paul thinks otherwise he can take a running jump.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:37 PM
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I agree with you. A lot of people don't really study the Bible all that deeply. If Paul only repeated the words of Jesus, why would his letters be included in the Bible? He is responding to problems in certain churches with teaching based on the truth taught by Jesus and his vast knowlege of the Hebrew Scriptures. It reminds me of the controversy the last few days over the supposed "new sins" announced by the pope. They aren't new sins, but application of Biblical truth to particular issues. I'd like to see a list of complaints against Paul and then have a study on them. <*)))><
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